Masochistic DQ'ed from BC Sprint

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Psychotic Parakeet
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Mon Dec 19, 2016 7:56 pm

Found steroids in his system, but here is the kicker, "According to Ellis, Masochistic – like all Breeders’ Cup runners -- was subject to out-of-competition testing in the weeks leading up to the Breeders’ Cup. He said Masochistic was tested three times, the final test being taken Oct. 28. He said he was not informed until Nov. 2, three days before the race, that Masochistic had traces of stanozolol in those tests. Neither the CHRB – whose medical director is Dr. Rick Arthur -- nor the Breeders’ Cup ordered Ellis to scratch. The decision was left to Ellis and Masochistic’s owners."

http://www.drf.com/news/masochistic-be- ... -bc-sprint
I wanna do bad things with you.
BaroqueAgain1
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Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:42 pm

Doesn't sound like a case where the trainer was trying to cheat, only another instance which may show that the recommended withdrawal time for a legal med is an inexact science. And that testing is very sensitive.

Trainer Ron Ellis acknowledged that he had given the steroid, which is legal in California, to Masochistic, 68 days ahead of the Breeders' Cup, within the recommended withdrawal period of 60 days.
“It wasn't hidden. It was fully disclosed with the state, as required,” said Ellis, who gave Masochistic's small size and difficulty maintaining weight as the reasons for the steroid's administration. “The amount is very, very small, but it doesn't matter. Just having a presence is enough.”
Ellis reported that each lab had found less than 200 picograms of stanozolol in Masochistic's blood on race day. Additionally, Ellis said that Masochistic had been subject to out-of-competition testing three times prior to the Breeders' Cup, and that he had been informed only on Nov. 2, three days prior to the race, that minute amounts of the steroid had been found. Breeders' Cup and the CHRB did not require Ellis to scratch the horse. Since the last test had occurred eight days before the race and showed a very small amount, Ellis was 90 percent certain that the drug would clear the horse's system.

Read more: http://www.paulickreport.com/news/the-b ... t-steroid/
stark
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Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:58 pm

The odd, funny, ironic, whatever, part of this story is that Masochistic was once trained by the one and only witch doctor AC Avila and won one of the biggest scamolas in Kentucky racing history shipping from SA to break his maiden.

And now he gets caught for drugs with Ron Ellis, this is un-b-lieve-a-ble. :lol:
Last edited by stark on Mon Dec 19, 2016 9:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I've found it easier to tear up tickets at 8/1 instead of 8/5.
lurkey mclurker
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Mon Dec 19, 2016 9:07 pm

And Joe Drape for some reason is kvetching at Privman for reporting it...? Or, um. "Commenting" instead of reporting? Because posting a quote is somehow not reporting anymore?
Jay Privman @DRFPrivman
Drug in question with Masochistic legal to give, but recommended withdrawal time is 60 days. Ellis: he was treated 68 days out, it lingered
Joe Drape @joedrape
You don't know that. Report; don't comment.
Jay Privman ‏@DRFPrivman
Everything in that tweet is 100 % accurate but thx for the j-school tip. All the best.
ETA more - srsly what is Drape's problem???
Joe Drape ‏@joedrape 13m 13 minutes ago

English major not a J-school, but notice this is Ellis account. Not even a CHRB declined comment? Did your cell phone die?
Greg Pierce @LvilleFan1 Greg Pierce Retweeted Joe Drape
What's odd is the owner of the horse that tested positive thanked Jay for writing a great piece. Wonder how much input they had in the story
Jay Privman ‏@DRFPrivman 9m 9 minutes ago
CHRB was contacted; sent out release. 2nd graph of story says, "The board, in a press notice put out Monday afternoon..." happy holidays Joe
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Sparrow Castle
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Fri Dec 23, 2016 2:36 pm

Ray Paulick ‏@raypaulick
Interesting Ron Ellis said Truesdail lab could not do test at level of detection by officlal @caCHRB lab in time frame required.
Image

From The Jockey Club:
New RCI Rule on Out-of-Competition Testing Needs to be Adopted to Avoid Future Scandals
http://jockeyclub.com/Default.asp?secti ... &story=953
MySaladDays
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Mon Dec 26, 2016 4:48 pm

where are the bettors in all this?
Admin
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Wed Dec 28, 2016 10:44 am

Ellis and undoubtedly others have figured out how to use steroids despite the general public thinking they were banned. I have zero sympathy for Ellis. Using steroids is cheating.

This puts a fresh perspective on all the horses taking 2 or more months between races, doesn't it?
"This is how we roll in the Shire." -- Leonard
Izvestia
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Wed Dec 28, 2016 11:04 am

Admin wrote:Ellis and undoubtedly others have figured out how to use steroids despite the general public thinking they were banned. I have zero sympathy for Ellis. Using steroids is cheating.

This puts a fresh perspective on all the horses taking 2 or more months between races, doesn't it?
I wholeheartedly agree. There is no place for steroids in horseracing.
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Starine
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Wed Dec 28, 2016 8:19 pm

Masochistic denied entry at Santa Anita
http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/ ... anta-anita
sweettalk
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Wed Dec 28, 2016 8:34 pm

omg. SA's people and how they're dealing with this make the Benny Hill music pop into my head.
Admin
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Wed Dec 28, 2016 9:58 pm

sweettalk wrote:omg. SA's people and how they're dealing with this make the Benny Hill music pop into my head.
I don't see it that way. I'd have assumed the horse needed to test clean by entry time else he couldn't be entered. Ellis had to know this was going to be an issue for the past month, yet he waited until just 5 days prior to a race? After telling everyone in his initialnexplanation for why his horse raced dirty was because they can't do testing in just a few days?

Sorry, Ellis, but this too falls on your shoulders.
"This is how we roll in the Shire." -- Leonard
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Starine
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Wed Dec 28, 2016 10:34 pm

One Horse, Two Scandals -- by Frank Angst
http://cs.bloodhorse.com/blogs/keeping- ... ndals.aspx
sweettalk
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Wed Dec 28, 2016 10:52 pm

Admin wrote:
sweettalk wrote:omg. SA's people and how they're dealing with this make the Benny Hill music pop into my head.
I don't see it that way. I'd have assumed the horse needed to test clean by entry time else he couldn't be entered. Ellis had to know this was going to be an issue for the past month, yet he waited until just 5 days prior to a race? After telling everyone in his initialnexplanation for why his horse raced dirty was because they can't do testing in just a few days?

Sorry, Ellis, but this too falls on your shoulders.
of course ellis isn't an angel here, but let the horse enter. if the test comes back with a positive, or doesn't come back, scratch him. it's not like horses are never scratched the day/morning of. between ellis and SA it's a disaster even the best fiction writer couldn't come up with.
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CoronadosQuest
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Thu Dec 29, 2016 12:55 am

Starine wrote:One Horse, Two Scandals -- by Frank Angst
http://cs.bloodhorse.com/blogs/keeping- ... ndals.aspx
Wow, I don't think I heard of the one where they thought they threw the first race so he could get better odds on Derby day...
Catalina
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Thu Dec 29, 2016 1:27 am

sweettalk wrote:
Admin wrote:
sweettalk wrote:omg. SA's people and how they're dealing with this make the Benny Hill music pop into my head.
I don't see it that way. I'd have assumed the horse needed to test clean by entry time else he couldn't be entered. Ellis had to know this was going to be an issue for the past month, yet he waited until just 5 days prior to a race? After telling everyone in his initialnexplanation for why his horse raced dirty was because they can't do testing in just a few days?

Sorry, Ellis, but this too falls on your shoulders.
of course ellis isn't an angel here, but let the horse enter. if the test comes back with a positive, or doesn't come back, scratch him. it's not like horses are never scratched the day/morning of. between ellis and SA it's a disaster even the best fiction writer couldn't come up with.
It doesn't bother you that disqualifying the horse later on would cheat the betting public, Sweettalk?
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Diver52
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Thu Dec 29, 2016 3:53 am

Well, in this case the level was so low that i doubt the result was affected or the bettors "cheated." How else could it have been handled, if Masochistic was "likely" to test clean by race day?
I ran marathons. I saw the Taj Mahal by Moonlight. I drove Highway 1 in a convertible. I petted Zenyatta.
sweettalk
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Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:15 am

Catalina wrote:
sweettalk wrote: of course ellis isn't an angel here, but let the horse enter. if the test comes back with a positive, or doesn't come back, scratch him. it's not like horses are never scratched the day/morning of. between ellis and SA it's a disaster even the best fiction writer couldn't come up with.
It doesn't bother you that disqualifying the horse later on would cheat the betting public, Sweettalk?
when did i say that? never.

i'm not talking about loading him in the gate for the race and letting him run without test results. in fact, i actually said if they dont come in [ideally before the daily changes are announced], then he should end up in those changes as a scratch. same for if they came back with a positive, "we found illegal stuff" result. if he doesn't run, no one can bet him, and no one gets screwed. late scratches result in refunded tickets, and i don't consider getting my ticket refunded as getting screwed. am i missing a step somewhere? some rule about scratching and horses not running and still being able to keep a live bet on them?

it's like opening your program, chosing your horses, then hearing your horse is a scratch even tho they arent listed as a scratch in the program, which doesn't seem to ever cause any outrage.
Somnambulist

Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:58 am

How quick can you even test for steroid usage? I didnt think it was that fast. And then there's the cost involved with processing it that quick right? Idk.

This is why the industry needs clear, uniform direction and rules. Everyone suffers for the lack of it
Admin
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Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:18 am

Sweet, something happens between entry and the race to facilitate a scratch. There are often penalties unless the horse became physically ill (change of surface notwithstanding).

With this horse, the problem was known going in to entries. It's the right call that he not be allowed to enter.

Som, Ellis said he couldn't get test results in a few days for the BC, but he can now (and over a holiday to boot)? Ellis had a month to get the horse tested. He didn't do it. This is totally on him.
"This is how we roll in the Shire." -- Leonard
Somnambulist

Thu Dec 29, 2016 11:18 am

Admin wrote:Sweet, something happens between entry and the race to facilitate a scratch. There are often penalties unless the horse became physically ill (change of surface notwithstanding).

With this horse, the problem was known going in to entries. It's the right call that he not be allowed to enter.

Som, Ellis said he couldn't get test results in a few days for the BC, but he can now (and over a holiday to boot)? Ellis had a month to get the horse tested. He didn't do it. This is totally on him.
He's only taking advantage of something that exists. I'm not saying it's right. The horse should have never been entered and it falls on him.

It's a shame because the bad apple spoils the bunch. Extremist idiots on social media hold a lot more power than they should. Racing should just fix itself before it comes to that. I don't really enjoying gambling personally but I bet nearly every BC race this year. I don't even know what I'm up against when I bet and I don't have the money to piss away on a rigged game. For a game that relies on part on handle you think they would make more of an effort. It leaves a bad taste in everyone's mouth and hurts the future of the game.
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