The VENT Thread

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ElPrado2
Posts: 1411
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:45 pm

Wed May 10, 2017 6:15 am

There were extenuating circumstances. Which she finally told me about. A friend was evacuated from her home 50 miles away because of a brush fire. The kid doesn't like the woman, and it's mutual. However, the brat is like a tornado. He had clothes with him, and changed them every time he went in the bathroom. Nothing I try to feed him will be edible, according to him. (I was stuck with him all day, worked as a short order cook and in a major restaurant as a cook) and I caught him trying to open a can of tuna with a boning knife. The vagaries of a can opener are beyond him. Instead he was pounding the knife into the can with a pot lid. ( I do have to use the restroom eventually). That I managed to get away from him. Then he didn't want tuna.We wound up with pizza.
I don't drink, but by the time Mom came back I was contemplating a bottle of tequila.
stark
Posts: 3862
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:55 am
Location: SoCal

Wed May 10, 2017 10:56 am

Insane Crazy wrote:Today my boss pulled me into her office to give me a talking-to about doing non-work related stuff during work time.

Here's what you should know about the privacy of your work emails—namely, that you don't have any.

Detailed legal explanations here... http://time.com/money/3729939/work-pers ... nton-byod/

1) Your employer can monitor pretty much anything you access on the company's computer system, even your personal email account.

2) Assume any email, text message, or other electronic communication you send on your employer's system can be used against you.

3) Beware of "George Carlin software."


4) Emailing company documents to your personal account could get you in trouble.

5) When you set up your company's email on your personal phone, you often give your employer the right to delete all of your personal data.
I've found it easier to tear up tickets at 8/1 instead of 8/5.
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War Admiral
Posts: 212
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Location: The Midwest

Wed May 10, 2017 12:04 pm

Yep. It's true. If you have a work email or account your supervisor can access anything and everything that you do on it. Even a simple Happy Birthday post to a friends Facebook page could potentially get you into trouble. Far better to pick up your personal phone ( if possible) for anything other than work related issues. If you can't have your phone with you at work it's better just to wait until you go on break to do your personal business.
Government is not the solution to the problem. Government is the problem. Ronald Reagan.
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Insane Crazy
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Wed May 10, 2017 12:22 pm

Oh, I fully understand it is well within her legal right. As I said, I am not at all bothered by the reprimand. I wouldn't even be bothered by her peeking at my sent emails to see how much time I had spent elsewhere (though I would be annoyed).

It was searching for stuff that had nothing to do with her concern. She knew exactly what I was working on, as I've seen the screenshots she took of my recent PDF documents, and they're all very clearly about the event. It's an Occam's Razor thing -- the most obvious distraction for me was this event, which she knew was weighing on me. The timestamp on those is BEFORE she went into my email and searched for "resume" or "counseling," both of which are personal things that are none of her damn business.

We have a four person office, with no HR or IT that normally an employer would need to go through to look at my email. She just gave me a guilt-tripping discussion about breaches of trust and decorum. It skeeves me out that she has unilateral power to do that, and that she used it for that specific purpose.

Interestingly enough, she didn't actually check my FB, which was also probably still logged in. Odd.
Not a wholesome trottin' race, no, but a race where they sit down right on the horse!
Like to see some stuck-up jockey boy sittin' on Dan Patch? Make your blood boil? Well, I should say!
Somnambulist
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Wed May 10, 2017 12:22 pm

I don't think IC thinks she has rights. Her manager was morally bankrupt.

And sounds like she's paranoid about losing an employee.
"Life's no piece of cake, mind you, but the recipe's my own to fool with."
stark
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Location: SoCal

Wed May 10, 2017 2:04 pm

Somnambulist wrote: Her manager was morally bankrupt.
And therein lies the problem.

I'm never quite sure why the employee has trouble understanding that there are consequences for stealing, it's not the manager's fault for catching them.

If there was a cash register in play, everybody seems to understand that taking a $20 out and putting it in your pocket is wrong and you could be punished. But if you cheat the system and take an extra $20 on your paycheck for work not performed....."well that's okay because everybody does it". WRONG!

Stealing is stealing, period. If you use company resources to conduct personal business while on the clock, you really don't have much to say in defense when you get caught, game over.
I've found it easier to tear up tickets at 8/1 instead of 8/5.
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Insane Crazy
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Wed May 10, 2017 3:00 pm

stark wrote:
Somnambulist wrote: Her manager was morally bankrupt.
And therein lies the problem.

I'm never quite sure why the employee has trouble understanding that there are consequences for stealing, it's not the manager's fault for catching them.

If there was a cash register in play, everybody seems to understand that taking a $20 out and putting it in your pocket is wrong and you could be punished. But if you cheat the system and take an extra $20 on your paycheck for work not performed....."well that's okay because everybody does it". WRONG!

Stealing is stealing, period. If you use company resources to conduct personal business while on the clock, you really don't have much to say in defense when you get caught, game over.
Lmao. I've said repeatedly that I understand my error and take full responsibility for it. Not once did I suggest her reprimanding me, or even checking my work computer, was wrong. I cop to it and I reflected my distraction on my timesheet. I'm not asking for payment for the time regardless.

But snooping for non-work related concerns on my personal email? For the term "counseling," which could have brought up countless things unrelated to any of her business? For trying to see if I sent a resume out, when I'm a half time employee in the first place? For reading a GChat log I had not accessed since October -- and then, not even at work when I did?

Sorry. That's not okay with me. Period. You can call me petulant all you want, but none of that had to do with the issue at hand.
Not a wholesome trottin' race, no, but a race where they sit down right on the horse!
Like to see some stuck-up jockey boy sittin' on Dan Patch? Make your blood boil? Well, I should say!
Somnambulist
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Wed May 10, 2017 3:14 pm

Reading comprehension is vital.
"Life's no piece of cake, mind you, but the recipe's my own to fool with."
stark
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Location: SoCal

Wed May 10, 2017 3:59 pm

I hear you say that you get it, but I'm not sure you really do.
It seems like you want to say "But, But...........she was wrong.

And when you say things like.....when I'm a half time employee in the first place?
I'm further convinced you don't really get it.

The manager is like a wife catching her husband cheating, there are no rules what she can and can't look for.
Live with it, turn the page and stop feeling infringed upon.
I've found it easier to tear up tickets at 8/1 instead of 8/5.
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Insane Crazy
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Wed May 10, 2017 4:48 pm

Y'know, it ain't worth the time. Employers don't have moral leave to look into an employee's private life. That's why work-based reprimands, write-ups, and protocols exist. Going outside of it is icky. Legal, but ethically questionable.

The half-time comment was in reference to the fact that I can apply for another half-time job and not have it impact her. It really isn't her business if I am, so long as I follow my contractual obligations to her.

Anyway. Yeah. My feelings of infringement are non-negotiable and I feel zero remorse for them when it comes to her actually using search keywords in my email related to therapy and non-work life. But it's all good -- I *am* applying to other jobs now and will be happy for a change of pace.
Not a wholesome trottin' race, no, but a race where they sit down right on the horse!
Like to see some stuck-up jockey boy sittin' on Dan Patch? Make your blood boil? Well, I should say!
Squally
Posts: 113
Joined: Fri Sep 13, 2013 12:45 pm

Wed May 10, 2017 6:16 pm

Insane Crazy wrote:Y'know, it ain't worth the time. Employers don't have moral leave to look into an employee's private life.
Maybe this is just me, I've spent the last 24 years working at a horse barn, not in an office environment. My question would be why are you sending your personal emails through your work computer? If it's on a work computer, I can understand a boss looking at it. I guess I'd just say if you have things you don't want people to know, use your own devices for emails and phone calls, etc.
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Insane Crazy
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Wed May 10, 2017 6:44 pm

Squally wrote:
Insane Crazy wrote:Y'know, it ain't worth the time. Employers don't have moral leave to look into an employee's private life.
Maybe this is just me, I've spent the last 24 years working at a horse barn, not in an office environment. My question would be why are you sending your personal emails through your work computer? If it's on a work computer, I can understand a boss looking at it. I guess I'd just say if you have things you don't want people to know, use your own devices for emails and phone calls, etc.
When I take my lunch and have breaks during the day, I check up on various things. So does everyone else in the office (not a justification of my distraction, but of standard office culture for our regulated free time.) I definitely wouldn't do this if I worked at a horse barn, hah, but since our office email is through Gmail, adding another address isn't hard or inherently intrusive.

On an ethical level, I expect my co-workers will stay out of my business unless it directly pertains to them, but I will be only checking my email through my phone from now on. Bleh.
Not a wholesome trottin' race, no, but a race where they sit down right on the horse!
Like to see some stuck-up jockey boy sittin' on Dan Patch? Make your blood boil? Well, I should say!
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starrydreamer
Posts: 436
Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2013 10:51 am

Wed May 10, 2017 6:46 pm

stark wrote:
Somnambulist wrote: Her manager was morally bankrupt.
And therein lies the problem.

I'm never quite sure why the employee has trouble understanding that there are consequences for stealing, it's not the manager's fault for catching them.

If there was a cash register in play, everybody seems to understand that taking a $20 out and putting it in your pocket is wrong and you could be punished. But if you cheat the system and take an extra $20 on your paycheck for work not performed....."well that's okay because everybody does it". WRONG!

Stealing is stealing, period. If you use company resources to conduct personal business while on the clock, you really don't have much to say in defense when you get caught, game over.
I think you are missing the point. IC knows she did wrong by doing personal things during work time. That isn't the issue.

The bigger issue is accessing an employee's personal email. We all know employees have no expectation of privacy when it comes to work email. But when it comes to social media and personal email, there is a growing number of states that are enacting legislation protecting employee privacy. IC - if you want, tell me what state you work in and I can let you know if there are any relevant laws.

And yeah, I'm a lawyer.

As for using work computers for personal use, I do it. I have to track my hours closely for budgetary purposes, so any time I spend doing nonwork things (like posting here), I make up at the end of the day (I get paid hourly). I don't do anything illegal, and I don't download personal things onto my hard drive, but I use Google Drive.
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Insane Crazy
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Wed May 10, 2017 6:50 pm

starrydreamer wrote:
stark wrote:
Somnambulist wrote: Her manager was morally bankrupt.
And therein lies the problem.

I'm never quite sure why the employee has trouble understanding that there are consequences for stealing, it's not the manager's fault for catching them.

If there was a cash register in play, everybody seems to understand that taking a $20 out and putting it in your pocket is wrong and you could be punished. But if you cheat the system and take an extra $20 on your paycheck for work not performed....."well that's okay because everybody does it". WRONG!

Stealing is stealing, period. If you use company resources to conduct personal business while on the clock, you really don't have much to say in defense when you get caught, game over.
I think you are missing the point. IC knows she did wrong by doing personal things during work time. That isn't the issue.

The bigger issue is accessing an employee's personal email. We all know employees have no expectation of privacy when it comes to work email. But when it comes to social media and personal email, there is a growing number of states that are enacting legislation protecting employee privacy. IC - if you want, tell me what state you work in and I can let you know if there are any relevant laws.

And yeah, I'm a lawyer.

As for using work computers for personal use, I do it. I have to track my hours closely for budgetary purposes, so any time I spend doing nonwork things (like posting here), I make up at the end of the day (I get paid hourly). I don't do anything illegal, and I don't download personal things onto my hard drive, but I use Google Drive.
I get the sense stark believes it's appropriate for an employer to do anything they want when an employee does something like this. That's just not something I think is true. In any case, I'm not sure why I signed a contract that clearly outlined our reprimand policy and escalation of conflict if that's true.

I'm in VT. I doubt there's anything specifically, but we're commune loving hippies. :D
Not a wholesome trottin' race, no, but a race where they sit down right on the horse!
Like to see some stuck-up jockey boy sittin' on Dan Patch? Make your blood boil? Well, I should say!
Catalina
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Location: South Texas

Wed May 10, 2017 7:03 pm

stark wrote:
Insane Crazy wrote:Today my boss pulled me into her office to give me a talking-to about doing non-work related stuff during work time.
Here's what you should know about the privacy of your work emails—namely, that you don't have any.
Exactly.
Tessablue
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Location: Boston

Wed May 10, 2017 7:08 pm

IC, it is super creepy and weird that she did that and you don't have to defend or justify your feelings to the usual suspects on here.

Hey stark! I bring my personal laptop to work every day and use it for whatever I want! It's so great!
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Insane Crazy
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Wed May 10, 2017 7:14 pm

Tessablue wrote:IC, it is super creepy and weird that she did that and you don't have to defend or justify your feelings to the usual suspects on here.

Hey stark! I bring my personal laptop to work every day and use it for whatever I want! It's so great!
:D You're a peach, Doctor Tessa.
Not a wholesome trottin' race, no, but a race where they sit down right on the horse!
Like to see some stuck-up jockey boy sittin' on Dan Patch? Make your blood boil? Well, I should say!
Somnambulist
Posts: 7382
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:59 pm

Wed May 10, 2017 7:15 pm

I left work 2 hours ago.

I'm now just on a train home.

Why am I spending $350 a month for this shit.
"Life's no piece of cake, mind you, but the recipe's my own to fool with."
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Insane Crazy
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Wed May 10, 2017 7:20 pm

Somnambulist wrote:I left work 2 hours ago.

I'm now just on a train home.

Why am I spending $350 a month for this shit.
:shock:

Yikes.

Was the train that late, or were they all full?

These sorts of things are why I live in freakin' Vermont. I get hives thinking about that. Sorry, Som.
Not a wholesome trottin' race, no, but a race where they sit down right on the horse!
Like to see some stuck-up jockey boy sittin' on Dan Patch? Make your blood boil? Well, I should say!
Somnambulist
Posts: 7382
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:59 pm

Wed May 10, 2017 7:22 pm

This is day six of signal delays. Penn Station is so bad the LIRR is police baracaded off.

I was going to get a beer but I was adult enough to realize I didn't want to hold me pee for hours. It's was the saddest realization of my life.
"Life's no piece of cake, mind you, but the recipe's my own to fool with."
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