Some elusive pedigrees

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Miesque1973
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Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 1:38 pm

Wed Jun 20, 2018 2:00 am

Well, I've got some good news, at last. After a bit of persuading and bargaining, I will be getting the majority of India's regional classic winners (i.e., Calcutta classics, Mysore classics, etc). For starters, I received full lists of the Bangalore classics:

Bangalore 2000 Guineas
Bangalore Derby
Bangalore St. Leger
Bangalore 1000 Guineas
Bangalore Oaks
Derby Bangalore
Bangalore Colts' Championship
Bangalore Fillies' Championship

The pedigrees of the following horses are proving elusive:

NOBLE SON(IND), b.c. 1972 Orbit(GB)
Prima Donna, c1962 ?
?

HOYSALA(IND), ch.c. 1970 Glory of Andhra(IND)
Nainaban, c1960 ?
?

COIN OF GOLD(IND), b.f. 1974 Goldbricker (is this the Buckpasser colt or another?)
Magic Touch, c1964 ?

MAJOLICA(IND), b.f. 1972 Punjab(GB)
Majorca(IND), 1961 Orcades(GB)
Farman, 1949 Ambush(GB)
Turf Queen, 1941 Pomme d'Api(FR)
?

GALILEE(IND), b.c. 1966 King of Pippins(GB)
Amukiriki, 1955 Steel Helmet(GB)
Zareen, 1947 Short Hand(GB)
Rathlee, 1930 ?
?

MONARCH(IND), ch.c. 1963 Zimone(FR)
Golden Angel, c1953 ?
?

EKTA(IND), b.f. 1972 High Commission(GB)
St. Bee, c1962 ?
?

SCHERZADEE(IND), b.f. 1962 Glasgow Paddock(GB)
Pushkami, c1952 ?
?

RARE GEM(IND), b.f. 1963 Asopo(ITY)
Georgiana, c1953 ?
?

HIS MAJESTY(IND), dkb.c. 1960 Hervine(GB)
Eastern Cheer, c1950 ?
?

Coat colors & country of birth would be nice, but the main objective right now is just connecting to existing lines. The winners' names are all now in the PQ database. Hopefully by this weekend I'll have whatever else I can get from India and eventually will get all the histories into PQ as well.

Any help will be appreciated.

~Miesque
Vice does not change its character by becoming fashionable.
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Miesque1973
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Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 1:38 pm

Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:49 pm

Also these horses:

MOHSIN THE SECOND(IND), br.c. 1956 Kimberley(GB)
Village Green, c1946 ?
?

ALI BABA(IND), b.c. 1957 Hyder Ali(GB)
Chocolate Baby, 1952 Carlisle
Parknasilla, c1942 ?
?

SILVER JET(IND), gr.c. 1962 Abbotship(GB)
Giselle, c1952 ?
?

Miesque
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Treve
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Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:58 pm

That's some great news... How'd you convince them in the end? :lol:
A filly named Ruffian...

Eine Stute namens Danedream...

Une pouliche se nommant Trêve...

Kincsem nevű kanca...


And a Queen named Beholder
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Miss Woodford
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Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:51 am

There's a 1972 mare Georgian Gem (IND) and a 1965 mare Mumtaz (IND) also by Asopo out of a mare named Georgiana (ch. M. 1958, Fairey Fulmar x La Nouba). Rare Gem would likely be a full sibling of Georgian Gem and Mumtaz.
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Miesque1973
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Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:27 am

Treve wrote:That's some great news... How'd you convince them in the end? :lol:
It finally worked out that I only had to pay $118 in US money (sent via Western Union) for just the lists of winners (with color/yob & sire & dam of each horse). The majority of the pedigrees are findable, but some will be more tricky, as I still can't afford the huge sum for a full subscription to the India Stud Book website.

Thanks, Miss Woodford, for the Georgiana pedigree. I should be able to update that one at PQ. :)

~Miesque
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Flanders
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Thu Jun 21, 2018 2:11 pm

Goldbricker (Buckpasser) was exported to India
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Miesque1973
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Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:10 pm

Flanders wrote:Goldbricker (Buckpasser) was exported to India
Yes! Thanks. I was about 95% sure he was the one, but couldn't find anything out there to confirm it... and really, why didn't I just look at PQ?! :D

~Miesque
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Miesque1973
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Sun Jun 24, 2018 11:27 pm

And a few more:

Shin Shinaki, 1947 Coeur de Lyon, c1937
pedigree of Coeur de Lyon is unknown, but the mare's female family is entered

Scherzadee(IND), b.f. 1962 Glasgow Paddock(GB)
Pushkarni, c1952 ?
?

Queen o'Scots(IND), b.f. 1969 Glasgow Paddock(GB)
Big Bess, c1959 ?
?

Majolica(IND), b.f. 1972 Punjab(GB)
Majorica(IND), 1961 Orcades(GB)
Farman, 1949 Ambush(GB)
Turf Queen, 1941 Pomme d'Api(FR)
?

Random Harvest(IND), b.c. 1956 Bellrue(GB)
Aroma, c1946 ?
?

Hustle(IND), b.c. 1960 Abbotship(GB)
Meher, c1950 ?
?

Super Seer(IND), b.c. 1969 King of Pippins(GB)
Lady Orcades, c1959 ?
?

Some of the pedigrees are a challenge and have been established by way of looking through Wetherby's progeny listings of some of the dams. (If she had a classic winning foal by Glasgow Paddock that *isn't* found anywhere, but had another foal by Glasgow Paddock that *is* found, then it stands to reason that she's the right mare to select as the classic-producing dam and it gives me a headache just thinking about it now).

The South Indian 2000 Guineas, Derby & 1000 Guineas histories are all added to the PQ stakes database. I'll be adding the St. Leger & Oaks during this week. I've got the histories of the following to add as time allows:

Calcutta 2000 Guineas, Derby, St. Leger, 1000 Guineas & Oaks
Golconda 2000 Guineas, Derby, St. Leger, 1000 Guineas, Oaks
Hyderabad Colts & Fillies' Championship Stakes
Mysore 2000 Guineas, Derby, 1000 Guineas
Nilgiris 2000 Guineas, Derby, 1000 Guineas
Deccan Derby
Pune Derby

I think there's a North Indian Derby, etc. & some others out there, but right now I'm happy with what I have. Oh, and Bangalore's classics are all entered at PQ, too. Exhausting but fun!

~Miesque
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Flanders
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Mon Jun 25, 2018 3:30 am

Could Couer De Lyon be Couer De Lion? He had a son that won the Indian 2000 Guineas in 1948.
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Miesque1973
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Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:57 pm

Flanders wrote:Could Couer De Lyon be Couer De Lion? He had a son that won the Indian 2000 Guineas in 1948.
I would say that he very likely is the same horse. So many different spellings are out there that things can get a bit murky!

And few more missing lines:

Bold Anne(IND), ch.f. 1955 Bold Bob(GB?)
x Queen Anne, c1945 ?
?

Bhishma(IND), ch.c. 1964 Hervine(GB)
Ganga, c1954 ?
?
(this horse is noted as 'NSB' in the list I got, which I think means not registered)

Mahasakthi(IND), b.f. 1965 Glory of Andhra(IND)
Lady of Persia, c1959 ?
?

For all that, the South Indian classics are all added to PQ database.

On to Calcutta. I'll have a nice 5-day weekend starting Friday night so I can get a bit done, though I think I might take a breather then and just relax a bit. Even pedigree geeks have got to eat some barbecue and watermelon and ponder 3-fingered demolitions experts selling firecrackers along hot Texas highways.

(I wish I had a good count of the number of mares I've found that have produced two or more classic winners around the world. The project continues to grow, alongside my Triple Crowns of the World project. I've divided the mares into groups by number of classic winners, and currently I'm divvying them up by country and 'international' (ala Maggie B.B. & My Charmer, etc.), with another file of the mares divided up by Bruce Lowe family #'s. It remains very exciting to find a mare to add to the list. :) )

~Miesque
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Miesque1973
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Wed Jun 27, 2018 12:25 am

And another hard-to-find line:

Makalu(IND), ch.c. 1972 Landigou(FR)
Gazelle, c1962 ?
?

~Miesque
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Miesque1973
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Fri Jun 29, 2018 1:07 am

No pedigree found:

Deccan Prince(IND), ch.c. 1979 Beauregard(?)
x Smiling Princess
won 1982 Golconda 2000 Guineas

Can't find a thing on this horse. I'm entering him into PQ database. Beauregard is already there. Smiling Princess has me stumped.

~Miesque
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Miesque1973
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Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:16 pm

The whole list of untraced lines:

MAJOLICA(IND), b.f. 1972 Punjab(GB)
Majorca(IND), 1961 Orcades(GB)
Farman, 1949 Ambush(GB)
Turf Queen, 1941 Pomme d'Api(FR)
?

COIN OF GOLD(IND), b.f. 1974 Goldbricker(USA)
Magic Touch, c1964 ?
?

HOYSALA(IND), ch.c. 1970 Glory of Andhra(IND)
Nainaban, c1960 ?
?

MOHSIN THE SECOND(IND), br.c. 1956 Kimberley(GB)
Village Green, c1946 ?
?

ALI BABA(IND), b.c. 1957 Hyder Ali(GB)
Chocolate Baby, 1952 Carlisle, c1942 (unknown pedigree)
Parknasilla, c1942 ?
?

HIS MAJESTY(IND), dkb.c. 1960 Hervine(GB)
Eastern Cheer, c1950 ?
?

SILVER JET(IND), gr.c. 1962 Abbotship(GB)
Giselle, c1952 ?
?

MONARCH(IND), ch.c. 1963 Zimone(FR)
Golden Angel, c1953 ?
?

GALILEE(IND), b.c. 1966 King of Pippins(GB)
Amukiriki, 1955 Steel Helmet(GB)
Zareen, 1947 Short Hand(GB)
Rathlee, 1930 ?
?

SCHERZADEE(IND), b.f. 1962 Glasgow Paddock(GB)
Paushkarni, 1952 ?
?

EKTA(IND), b.f. 1972 High Commission(GB)
St. Bee, c1962 ?
?

DESERT FIRE(IND), ch.f. 1959 Cornish Flame(GB)
Tripoli, c1949 ?
?

FUSEBOX(IND), ch.f. 1964 Buskin(GB)
Rang Mahal(IND), 1954 Mackann(FR)
Queen of Gwalior(IND) Sheridan(GB)
Rathlee, 1930 ?
?

MOUNTAIN LILY(IND), (ntb) dkb.f. 1970 Cradle of the Deep(GB)
Ballerina, c1959 (ntb) ?
?

GOLD SPAN(IND), b.g. 1956 Fair Ray(GB)
Bally Bridge(IND), blk. 1949 Ballinahown
Blue Water, c1939 ?
?

VOLUNTARY(IND), b.c. 1968 State Trumpeter(GB)
Water Music, 1961 Exaggerator(GB)
Bally Bridge(IND), blk. 1949 Ballinahown
Blue Water, c1939 ?
?

PUNTER'S DELIGHT(IND), ch.c. 1973 Red Royal(GB)
Blue-Blazer, c1963 ?
?

WISEMAN(IND), ch.c. 1955 Tarquinius Superbus(GB)
Brioche, c1945 ?
?

PORTOFINO(IND), b.c. 1961 Port Desire(GB)
My Choice, c1948 ?
?

ROBERT BRUCE(IND), ch.c. 1961 Roman Honey(GB)
Highland Fling, c1951 ?
?

MIND DYNASTY(IND), ch.c. 1975 Simead(GB)
My Sparrow, 1970 Mighty Sparrow
Noor-e-Hind, 1953 ?
?

SUN LION(IND), b.c. 1976 Voluntary(IND)
Major Barbara, c1966 ?
?

MAKALU(IND), ch.c. 1972 Landigou(FR)
Gazelle, c1962 ?
?


DECCAN PRINCE(IND), ch.c. 1979 Beauregard(?)
x Smiling Princess ?
?

BOLD ANNE(IND), ch.f. 1955 Bold Bob(GB?)
x Queen Anne, c1945 ?
?

BHISHMA(IND), (nsb) ch.c. 1964 Hervine(GB)
Ganga, c1954 ?
?
(this horse is noted as 'NSB' in the list I got, which I think means not registered)

MAHASAKTHI(IND), b.f. 1965 Glory of Andhra(IND)
Lady of Persia, c1959 ?
?

RANDOM HARVEST(IND), b.c. 1956 Bellrue(GB)
Aroma, c1946 ?
?

HUSTLE(IND), b.c. 1960 Abbotship(GB)
Meher, c1950 ?
?

SUPER SEER(IND), b.c. 1969 King of Pippins(GB)
Lady Orcades, c1959 ?
?

QUEEN O' SCOTS(IND), b.f. 1969 Glasgow Paddock(GB)
Big Bess, c1959 ?

RARE GEM(IND), b.f. 1963 Asopo(ITY)
Georgiana, c1953 ?
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ElPrado2
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Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:10 pm

NSB is non stud book.
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