Fun with Obscure Pedigrees

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Miesque1973
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Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 1:38 pm

Tue Apr 19, 2016 1:30 pm

I'm searching for the female line of this mare:

SILVERTON(KEN), gray, foaled 1996, by Rana Pratap(USA)
x Cape Wind(KEN), yob?? by Murrmatch(GB)
x Torcombe, yob?? by Dobrush(ITY)
x Torvale, yob??, by Toronto(GB)

According to PQ, Torvale's dam might be a mare named Landswell, foaled c. 1952, but there's nothing much to verify that.

Silverton is the dam of:
Heard the One(KEN), gr.f. 2008 (Heard a Whisper(GB) - Kenya Fillies' Guineas, Kenya Oaks
Roxanne(KEN), gr.f. 2007 (Landfall(SNL) - Kenya Oaks

Torvale's dam may be a mare named Lanswell, foaled c. 1952. Silverton is very likely a half-bred, since the Kenya Jockey Club Stud Book has the mare in the "List of Mares Not Eligible for the Stud Book", but I want to be sure that there's no connections to any confirmed lines.

And yes, I am tormenting myself again, trying to find obscure horses that won Triple Crown races in various countries, hither to yon. I'm deep into Zimbabwe again and then took a foray into Kenya. I don't know why.

And by the way, what is 'SNL' supposed to stand for, aside from 'unfunny skit show on NBC'?

Any theories? :)

~Miesque
Vice does not change its character by becoming fashionable.
neighhey
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Tue Apr 19, 2016 3:04 pm

Well, I had never though about horse racing in Kenya. So I've learned something today! ;)

Maybe SNL is Senegal?
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Miesque1973
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Tue Apr 19, 2016 5:13 pm

I was thinking that Senegal might be it (if I can get the pedigree of the horse in question, I might be able to confirm it at bloodlines.net). If they can have racing in Kenya (Beryl Markham trained a filly named Wise Child to win the Kenya St. Leger in 1930-something), they might well have racing Senegal. If they have racing in Senegal, and a Triple Crown series, then I really do have my work cut out! :D

Landfall(SNL), 1998 Llandaff-Vilhena(SWI), by Last Fandago(IRE)

(bloodlines.net designates Senegal as 'SEN', by the way. So I'm still a little fumbuzzled, though I do think Senegal is the best bet. Plus there's lists of Kenyan classic winners--http://www.jockeyclubofkenya.com/pdf/Past_winners.pdf-- back to... well, a few years ago, anyway. I have no doubt these races have been around a lot longer than they're saying)

I did not find Landfall himself anywhere but in the Kenya Jockey Club Stud Book (google it--it comes right up in PDF), but I did find his dam in the APR.

~Miesque
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BlindLucky
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Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:05 pm

I read something that suggested SNL means "sired north of the line" (north of the equator), but that doesn't sound very specific.

Page 4 of the South African Paint and Pinto Club defines it that way:
http://littlegoliath.co.za/Paintpinto/S ... 0-2015.pdf
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BlindLucky
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Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:09 pm

Okay, yeah, here's a whole article on the SNL designation:
http://epublishbyus.com/ebook/ebook?id=10004812#/32

"Southern hemisphere yearlings sired by a stallion in the northern hemisphere."
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neighhey
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Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:39 pm

I have no clue if this is of any value in this discussion, but apparently Senegal DOES have racing. I've found info about a racetrack in Thies.
https://m.facebook.com/courseshippiquesausenegal/
neighhey
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Tue Apr 19, 2016 10:02 pm

In case you wanted to read even more about SNL ;)

http://www.kznbreeders.co.za/News22082011.html

I really had no idea...always cool to learn something new!
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Flanders
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Wed Apr 20, 2016 1:46 am

Not really helping but I read the Kenya Derby was first held in 1914. I don't know if its been run the entire time though.
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Miesque1973
Posts: 238
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Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:58 am

<shrieks> 1914? And I thought Scandinavia's Triple Crown histories were a nightmare! LOL!

Zimbabwe's Triple Crown is also a hideous venture. The Bloodstock South Africa is one of the legs in that series, but I've not been able to find winners prior to 2009. Possibly the name was changed or it was a different race entirely or maybe it's all just my imagination.

~Miesque
Vice does not change its character by becoming fashionable.
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Treve
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Wed Apr 20, 2016 12:27 pm

Keep doing god's work, Miesque :lol:
I am at work but if I can find a moment to myself I will see if I can help dig up anything.
A filly named Ruffian...

Eine Stute namens Danedream...

Une pouliche se nommant Trêve...

Kincsem nevű kanca...


And a Queen named Beholder
neighhey
Posts: 733
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 9:12 pm

Wed Apr 20, 2016 9:08 pm

I found the following article:
http://sportszone.co.zw/?p=4184

It mentions that there have been 7 winners of the TC in Zimbabwe in over 100 years.

In addition, I found an article which mentions recent winners.
http://www.herald.co.zw/all-the-pretty-horses/

You've probably already seen this, but just in case...
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Miesque1973
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Thu Apr 21, 2016 11:48 pm

Well, I don't think it's Senegal after all.

Per this website: http://www.nhra.co.za/common/countrycodes.php, SNL means 'Sired North of the Line'. So I'm guessing (and mind it's past my bedtime and I'm getting tired of the names of Zimbabwe's major races being changed every blasted year) that means 'north of the equator'. So BlindLucky is right!

The Zimbabwean Filly Triple Crown series, if anybody wants to know, is the Zimbabwe Fillies Guineas, Zimbabwe Oaks and the Silver Slipper Stakes (try saying that fast three times). www.aro.co.za has some info, and then it doesn't have info. The names of the races get changed back and forth and the site does NOT list histories of races from Zimbabwe, but if you go into Zimbabwe races and spend hours and hours and hours and hours going through dates (guesstimating the general time of year the race is run) you might, more or less accidentally, find a few winners.

Let's just say it's a good thing I don't drink. (And if I was drunk, I don't think I'd get much accomplished, aside from appearances on World's Wildest Police Videos ("Do you know why I pulled you over, ma'am?" "Yes! You found out who won the Zimbabwe Fillies' Guineas in 2010!")

Zimbabwe has had the following horses sweep the Triple Crown (Zimbabwe Derby, Zimbabwe Guineas, Bloodstock Africa 2000/various other names that I can't remember now and forgot to write down...):

Island Farewell (1983)
Match Winner (1986)
Stay Alert (1995)
Summer Silence (1997)
Glen Monarch (2006)
Earl of Surrey (2007)
Rebecca's Fleet (2009)
Madigan (2012)

One filly has won the Zimbabwe Fillies' Triple Crown:

Casey's Dance (2014)

I'm not even going to try and start looking up the pedigrees yet. I want to find out if any mares produced more than one winner of any of these races (in Zimbabwe or South Africa), but I'm tired, my knee hurts and I have a fire ant bite on my ankle and my car's warning light keeps telling me the left rear tire is low on pressure.

I know none of that has anything to do with racing in Africa, but it all just ticks me off!

I'll be nicer tomorrow. I need Aleve. Thanks to everybody who is/was/continues to look for info.

~Miesque
Vice does not change its character by becoming fashionable.
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