TBC Breeders Cup Watch Party/Discussion Thread

Macaroni
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:00 pm

Tessablue wrote:
Macaroni wrote:I haven't read up too much on what Juddmonte has said re: Arrogate's retirement, but is there any reason they choose now to retire him rather than retiring him after say, the Pegasus? Breeding season wouldn't even start til after that, right?
I read somewhere that they wanted to give him time to come down after his last race- I guess on the precedent of Chrome who apparently got a late start or something this year.
That makes sense. Though it may also be in their best interest to give him a shot at another win before retiring him. Oh well, womp womp, c'est la vie, etc. Was nice while it lasted.

Anyway, go Gun Runner! What a champ. Have been excited about him for a while, really looking forward to seeing his career continue (I assume?)
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Insane Crazy
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:00 pm

Is GR slated to retire or are they open to a 5 year old season?
Not a wholesome trottin' race, no, but a race where they sit down right on the horse!
Like to see some stuck-up jockey boy sittin' on Dan Patch? Make your blood boil? Well, I should say!
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Treve
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:02 pm

Insane Crazy wrote:Is GR slated to retire or are they open to a 5 year old season?
not 100% sure on this but I recall comments that depending on how he finished out the year, another season wouldn't be out of the question and I seem to remember they for sure want to take a shot at the PWC.
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Macaroni
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:02 pm

Treve wrote:
Insane Crazy wrote:Is GR slated to retire or are they open to a 5 year old season?
not 100% sure on this but I recall comments that depending on how he finished out the year, another season wouldn't be out of the question and I seem to remember they for sure want to take a shot at the PWC.
Good timing on this question - they just said on NBC that his owners have been talking about racing him next year, def giving him a chance in the PWC. Yay!
Last edited by Macaroni on Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Miss Woodford
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:03 pm

BaroqueAgain1 wrote:Guess this confirms that Arrogate really, really, REALLY hates Del Mar. :P Hate to see the big grey go out on such a low note. Which seem to be the BC theme this year. :(
Great run by the Gunner. So...does this earn him the HOTY title? Hard to believe, after Arrogate's stunning wins in the Pegasus and World Cup, that we would be talking about anyone else getting HOTY.
It just has to be Gun Runner. This is Horse of the Year, not Horse of the Spring. Arrogate won two races this year, two very big races but still just two, and wasn't the Pegasus counted for last year's Eclipse?

GR won the Stephen Foster, Whitney, Woodward, and now the Breeders Cup. With the west coasters beating each other up and Arrogate doing poorly much of the year, that's a HOTY campaign.
Macaroni
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:05 pm

Miss Woodford wrote:
BaroqueAgain1 wrote:Guess this confirms that Arrogate really, really, REALLY hates Del Mar. :P Hate to see the big grey go out on such a low note. Which seem to be the BC theme this year. :(
Great run by the Gunner. So...does this earn him the HOTY title? Hard to believe, after Arrogate's stunning wins in the Pegasus and World Cup, that we would be talking about anyone else getting HOTY.
It just has to be Gun Runner. This is Horse of the Year, not Horse of the Spring. Arrogate won two races this year, two very big races but still just two, and wasn't the Pegasus counted for last year's Eclipse?

GR won the Stephen Foster, Whitney, Woodward, and now the Breeders Cup. With the west coasters beating each other up and Arrogate doing poorly much of the year, that's a HOTY campaign.
1) Not sure how this works, but my assumption is that "the year" means the calendar year, so the Pegasus would be counted in this year's accomplishments
2) Technically 1 win this year since the DWC doesn't technically count
3) Based on accomplishments, Gun Runner should probably win, but lest we forget the winners of previous years and how the system works - it often amounts more to voter favorites than merely accomplishment-based
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Insane Crazy
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:06 pm

I feel like if GR goes to the Pegasus, he may as well race the rest of the year too. At least, I hope that's how it goes. Would love to see another season from him -- he's clearly peaking. What a fun Met Mile horse could be!

Talking about it with a friend, but....for all I can recall, did they even run the Derby this year? It took me 20 minutes to remember Cloud Computing's name. Oy vey. Viva la older horse!
Not a wholesome trottin' race, no, but a race where they sit down right on the horse!
Like to see some stuck-up jockey boy sittin' on Dan Patch? Make your blood boil? Well, I should say!
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CoronadosQuest
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:06 pm

Miss Woodford wrote:
BaroqueAgain1 wrote:Guess this confirms that Arrogate really, really, REALLY hates Del Mar. :P Hate to see the big grey go out on such a low note. Which seem to be the BC theme this year. :(
Great run by the Gunner. So...does this earn him the HOTY title? Hard to believe, after Arrogate's stunning wins in the Pegasus and World Cup, that we would be talking about anyone else getting HOTY.
It just has to be Gun Runner. This is Horse of the Year, not Horse of the Spring. Arrogate won two races this year, two very big races but still just two, and wasn't the Pegasus counted for last year's Eclipse?

GR won the Stephen Foster, Whitney, Woodward, and now the Breeders Cup. With the west coasters beating each other up and Arrogate doing poorly much of the year, that's a HOTY campaign.
No, Pegasus wouldnt have been last year's eclipse as the Pegasus was January 28th and the Eclipse Awards were Jan 27th haha
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Treve
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:08 pm

Miss Woodford wrote:
BaroqueAgain1 wrote:Guess this confirms that Arrogate really, really, REALLY hates Del Mar. :P Hate to see the big grey go out on such a low note. Which seem to be the BC theme this year. :(
Great run by the Gunner. So...does this earn him the HOTY title? Hard to believe, after Arrogate's stunning wins in the Pegasus and World Cup, that we would be talking about anyone else getting HOTY.
It just has to be Gun Runner. This is Horse of the Year, not Horse of the Spring. Arrogate won two races this year, two very big races but still just two, and wasn't the Pegasus counted for last year's Eclipse?

GR won the Stephen Foster, Whitney, Woodward, and now the Breeders Cup. With the west coasters beating each other up and Arrogate doing poorly much of the year, that's a HOTY campaign.
The PWC was on January 28th, I don't think it would've counted for the Eclipse lol.
But I do think it will be Gun Runner, if you base on the number of total G1 wins, and the added weight of the BCC. He beat Arrogate and he beat the horse who beat Arrogate previously, and now finished ahead a second time of the big grey.
A filly named Ruffian...

Eine Stute namens Danedream...

Une pouliche se nommant Trêve...

Kincsem nevű kanca...


And a Queen named Beholder
tcw
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:10 pm

Horsebagger wrote:Gunrunner was huge, and ate all my tickets because i gave him no credit to get 10 furlongs against these.

Candy Ride is some stallion. Fee going up, i'm sure. (although I've been calling for it the past few years and it wasn't happening)
And he was some racehorse, Candy Ride that is. He was absolutely brilliant and could carry his speed a distance of ground. I still remember him blowing by MDO in the Pacific Classic - in fact, I believe he still holds the 80 year old track record for 10F at DMR, plus other records in his fairly brief career. He was also outstanding on grass.
katmandu
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:11 pm

Macaroni wrote:
Miss Woodford wrote:
BaroqueAgain1 wrote:Guess this confirms that Arrogate really, really, REALLY hates Del Mar. :P Hate to see the big grey go out on such a low note. Which seem to be the BC theme this year. :(
Great run by the Gunner. So...does this earn him the HOTY title? Hard to believe, after Arrogate's stunning wins in the Pegasus and World Cup, that we would be talking about anyone else getting HOTY.
It just has to be Gun Runner. This is Horse of the Year, not Horse of the Spring. Arrogate won two races this year, two very big races but still just two, and wasn't the Pegasus counted for last year's Eclipse?

GR won the Stephen Foster, Whitney, Woodward, and now the Breeders Cup. With the west coasters beating each other up and Arrogate doing poorly much of the year, that's a HOTY campaign.
1) Not sure how this works, but my assumption is that "the year" means the calendar year, so the Pegasus would be counted in this year's accomplishments
2) Technically 1 win this year since the DWC doesn't technically count
3) Based on accomplishments, Gun Runner should probably win, but lest we forget the winners of previous years and how the system works - it often amounts more to voter favorites than merely accomplishment-based

It won't be possible to discount GR winning the BCC and how poorly Arrogate ran. I think GR would get it even if Arrogate had run a game second, but that's not what happened. Arrogate's 4 race run was remarkable, but only 2 good races this year. GR's wins at Saratoga weren't exactly chopped liver. . . .

And I'm not a particular fan of either horse.
Macaroni
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:13 pm

katmandu wrote:
Macaroni wrote:
1) Not sure how this works, but my assumption is that "the year" means the calendar year, so the Pegasus would be counted in this year's accomplishments
2) Technically 1 win this year since the DWC doesn't technically count
3) Based on accomplishments, Gun Runner should probably win, but lest we forget the winners of previous years and how the system works - it often amounts more to voter favorites than merely accomplishment-based
It won't be possible to discount GR winning the BCC and how poorly Arrogate ran. I think GR would get it even if Arrogate had run a game second, but that's not what happened. Arrogate's 4 race run was remarkable, but only 2 good races this year. GR's wins at Saratoga weren't exactly chopped liver. . . .

And I'm not a particular fan of either horse.
Oh I totally agree, I'm just thinking of 2010 - I'm a big Zenyatta fan, but her HOTY win that year was largely based on the fact that people thought she deserved it for her career in general and it was her last chance to snag the award. Accomplishments-wise, I'm not sure her 2010 year should have garnered her that award. I could in theory see this happening again with Arrogate, particularly considering he didn't get HOTY last year, either.
Tessablue
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:16 pm

Gun Runner should and definitely will be HOTY this year. Arrogate should have won it last year but... didn't. I feel so terrible for him, he deserves a better historical legacy than this.
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Life At Zen
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:16 pm

Macaroni wrote:
katmandu wrote:
Macaroni wrote:
1) Not sure how this works, but my assumption is that "the year" means the calendar year, so the Pegasus would be counted in this year's accomplishments
2) Technically 1 win this year since the DWC doesn't technically count
3) Based on accomplishments, Gun Runner should probably win, but lest we forget the winners of previous years and how the system works - it often amounts more to voter favorites than merely accomplishment-based
It won't be possible to discount GR winning the BCC and how poorly Arrogate ran. I think GR would get it even if Arrogate had run a game second, but that's not what happened. Arrogate's 4 race run was remarkable, but only 2 good races this year. GR's wins at Saratoga weren't exactly chopped liver. . . .

And I'm not a particular fan of either horse.
Oh I totally agree, I'm just thinking of 2010 - I'm a big Zenyatta fan, but her HOTY win that year was largely based on the fact that people thought she deserved it for her career in general and it was her last chance to snag the award. Accomplishments-wise, I'm not sure her 2010 year should have garnered her that award. I could in theory see this happening again with Arrogate, particularly considering he didn't get HOTY last year, either.
Huge difference in peaking in the spring with some big wins and finishing off the board in the BCC as opposed to an undefeated year long campaign that culminated in a tremendous runner up effort...
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Miss Woodford
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:17 pm

CoronadosQuest wrote:
Miss Woodford wrote:
BaroqueAgain1 wrote:Guess this confirms that Arrogate really, really, REALLY hates Del Mar. :P Hate to see the big grey go out on such a low note. Which seem to be the BC theme this year. :(
Great run by the Gunner. So...does this earn him the HOTY title? Hard to believe, after Arrogate's stunning wins in the Pegasus and World Cup, that we would be talking about anyone else getting HOTY.
It just has to be Gun Runner. This is Horse of the Year, not Horse of the Spring. Arrogate won two races this year, two very big races but still just two, and wasn't the Pegasus counted for last year's Eclipse?

GR won the Stephen Foster, Whitney, Woodward, and now the Breeders Cup. With the west coasters beating each other up and Arrogate doing poorly much of the year, that's a HOTY campaign.
No, Pegasus wouldnt have been last year's eclipse as the Pegasus was January 28th and the Eclipse Awards were Jan 27th haha
Oh yeah, it's been a while then lol. Still, you can't give a horse HOTY if they've only won a single race (since DWC doesn't count, not being on American soil).
SuperStarVincent
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:22 pm

Horsebagger wrote:Gunrunner was huge, and ate all my tickets because i gave him no credit to get 10 furlongs against these.

Candy Ride is some stallion. Fee going up, i'm sure. (although I've been calling for it the past few years and it wasn't happening)
It's absurdly low at 60k, but should have gone up years ago. Maybe they move it to 75k after this year (leading active sire!), but we'll see.
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Ballerina
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 9:34 pm

GUN RUNNER WILL BE HORSE OF THE YEAR - no doubt about it. He'll be back for the Pegasus. Depending on how he does in that will decide whether he races the rest of the year, but I'll bet they won't send him back to Dubai.

Great horse - never a doubt in my mind he was going to go off the favorite (even if it was co-favorite) and that he would win.
middleground
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 10:30 pm

Tessablue wrote:Gun Runner should and definitely will be HOTY this year. Arrogate should have won it last year but... didn't. I feel so terrible for him, he deserves a better historical legacy than this.
Arrogate at his best is a very, very good horse--an exceptional talent. A pity that he goes out on such a sour note. I wish they'd run him back, but even the greats can tail off.

Candy Ride is becoming an exceptional sire of top class older horses--he reminds me a bit of Bull Lea in that regard, except that he seems to get horses that can breed on, e.g., Twirling Candy.
katmandu
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 11:04 pm

Preliminary BSF from DRF Live:

Caledonia Road, Juvenile Fillies (82)
Stormy Liberal, Turf Sprint (103)
Bar of Gold, Filly & Mare Sprint (94)
Wuheida, Filly & Mare Turf (104)
Roy H, Sprint (111)
World Approval, Mile (107)
Good Magic, Juvenile (100)
Talismanic, Turf (108)
Gun Runner, Classic (117)
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starrydreamer
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Sat Nov 04, 2017 11:11 pm

Late to the party.

Pleased that Lancaster Bomber was second in the Mile. That's his second straight second in a BC race (he was second last year in the Juvenile Turf).

And Cambodia was third in the F&M Turf! She's really coming into herself and I hope she stays racing next year.
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