The Preakness

Re: The Preakness

Postby firehorse » Sat May 20, 2017 10:11 pm

Hats off to the winner but I thought Classic Empire ran like a champ, would really like to see him win another big 3 year old race this year.
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Re: The Preakness

Postby Kay16 » Sat May 20, 2017 10:27 pm

The connections agree. No excuses for Always Dreaming.

https://www.americasbestracing.net/the- ... onnections
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Re: The Preakness

Postby MySaladDays » Sat May 20, 2017 10:41 pm

BaroqueAgain1 wrote:I hope he gets some time off, and we see a refreshed (but not TOO fresh :P) colt in the Summer Classics.


Like Super Saver, his career will be over by the end of Fall 2017. a Pletcher specialty--- creating value for selling and breeding. We are not talking Mandella or Jerkens here.

Pletcher will have another 200+ horses in his barn to lightly race then retire to the shed soon enough.

Of course, our horses being the drug addicts we have turned them into, they can't perform on short rest like the ones who aren't consistently drugged....the recovery time is just not there.
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Re: The Preakness

Postby BigCountry » Sat May 20, 2017 11:46 pm

MySaladDays wrote:
BaroqueAgain1 wrote:I hope he gets some time off, and we see a refreshed (but not TOO fresh :P) colt in the Summer Classics.


Like Super Saver, his career will be over by the end of Fall 2017. a Pletcher specialty--- creating value for selling and breeding. We are not talking Mandella or Jerkens here.

Pletcher will have another 200+ horses in his barn to lightly race then retire to the shed soon enough.

FWIW, of his 15 graded stakes wins so far this year, more than half are with 4yo+ horses. In addition, the number of horses he's trained to win Eclipse Awards as older horses dwarfs the number of 2yo Eclipse winners he's had.
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Re: The Preakness

Postby Admin » Sun May 21, 2017 12:43 am

Spahny wrote:With the draw the race set up for Classic Empire to pressure Always Dreaming all the way around and that is what the jock did. JL rode it like it was a two horse race and when he put the favorite away it looked like he thought he had the race won. He might have moved too early. I think that is what Admin might have been referring to in this thread. But I'm not going there. I thought the race was over at the 1/8th pole too. Then CE hung the final sixteenth. Out of gas. But very game.

Cloud Computing was not exactly flying home. He edged past a very tired horse that actually showed heart and fought back as well as he could when collared and passed. I can't imagine this is going to be a very highly rated Preakness.

Always Dreaming was under pressure on the inside. I don't think he liked that much. He quit. It was only his fifth race. Hopefully he is back to fight again.


Actually, I'm just lost. The poster indicated surprise at AD going to the front. Isn't that his thing, and what he did in the Derby? I didn't imagine he'd be anywhere but the front, so thought she meant being surprised at CE being up there pressing the pace.

Bummer for Casse. He had to think like we did, that his colt had it won. This isn't the strongest group of males, but think this race proved CE is at the head of the class. That said, it'll be a little weird to see him ranked as such in the NTRA poll when he lost the Derby and Preakness and won just a single race this year.

Congrats to Serling I suppose, but he lets his fanship of Brown cloud his handicapping. He maybe gotten lucky this time, but picking PJ as the Derby winner? I guess he got back what he lost on the Derby.

What else? Oh, yeah, I think the best 3yo period is a filly on layoff in Hollendorfer's barn. And Mandella's filly I suspect will return from her Oaks showing that she's better too.
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Re: The Preakness

Postby BaroqueAgain1 » Sun May 21, 2017 1:10 am

Well then...speaking of fillies, do you know yet whether Songbird is headed to the Beholder, or to the Ogden Phipps? ;)
Can't wait to see Unique Bella return to the races. The colts this year have been so-so IMHO, so I'm looking forward to all the Stellar fillies & mares bringing the fireworks.
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Re: The Preakness

Postby tcw » Sun May 21, 2017 1:31 am

Jerry Bailey mentioned on TV before the race that he had spoken with Julien L. and the plan was to hit the gas pedal with CE from the start -- no secret, and that's just exactly what he did. But I would agree with those that say CE is currently at the top of his class, which probably isn't saying all that much considering. Should CC, however, come back and win the Belmont and perhaps other big 3yo races during the next several months, then obviously he will jump up. One last thing... I truly wonder had CE been in the B2 barn this past winter and spring if we would have seen different results at this point? In some ways CE reminds me of American Pharaoh (versatility, etc.) and their pedigrees are also very similar.
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Re: The Preakness

Postby Kay16 » Sun May 21, 2017 2:19 am

Admin wrote:
Spahny wrote:With the draw the race set up for Classic Empire to pressure Always Dreaming all the way around and that is what the jock did. JL rode it like it was a two horse race and when he put the favorite away it looked like he thought he had the race won. He might have moved too early. I think that is what Admin might have been referring to in this thread. But I'm not going there. I thought the race was over at the 1/8th pole too. Then CE hung the final sixteenth. Out of gas. But very game.

Cloud Computing was not exactly flying home. He edged past a very tired horse that actually showed heart and fought back as well as he could when collared and passed. I can't imagine this is going to be a very highly rated Preakness.

Always Dreaming was under pressure on the inside. I don't think he liked that much. He quit. It was only his fifth race. Hopefully he is back to fight again.


Actually, I'm just lost. The poster indicated surprise at AD going to the front. Isn't that his thing, and what he did in the Derby? I didn't imagine he'd be anywhere but the front, so thought she meant being surprised at CE being up there pressing the pace.

Bummer for Casse. He had to think like we did, that his colt had it won. This isn't the strongest group of males, but think this race proved CE is at the head of the class. That said, it'll be a little weird to see him ranked as such in the NTRA poll when he lost the Derby and Preakness and won just a single race this year.

Congrats to Serling I suppose, but he lets his fanship of Brown cloud his handicapping. He maybe gotten lucky this time, but picking PJ as the Derby winner? I guess he got back what he lost on the Derby.

What else? Oh, yeah, I think the best 3yo period is a filly on layoff in Hollendorfer's barn. And Mandella's filly I suspect will return from her Oaks showing that she's better too.



I think that just shows how not that great this group of males are and how unlucky CE has been. CE is definitely the top of this class and should be a force later on. As talented as that filly you speak of is, she's not beating anything near better than these males in her races so far, so I'll reserve saying she's better. Even Rachel Alexandra didn't prove lengths better as many thought she would against the poor crop of males and older males she faced. People are quick to forget the difference between males and females in this sport sometimes.


But no one is looking hopeful against Arrogate at this point that's for sure.
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Re: The Preakness

Postby Horsebagger » Sun May 21, 2017 7:11 am

Somnambulist wrote:Who cares, he's a cancer on the sport. He dishes it so he can theoretically take it.

I feel like feeling bad for him is like feeling bad for my clients whining about money when they own 5 homes and a Bentley.


A cancer? whoa back....way overboard, imo. Andy can be abrasive at times in defending his opinion (publicly and privately), but I've yet to find anyone in the sport who says anything about him other than he's their friend. His job is to often be critical, and he is. Even when he's talking about friends (i.e. Chad Brown). He is very open about his friendship with Chad and while he often lands on a CB horse, well, Chad seems to win a lot. And Andy doesn't hesitate to point out often that Chad gets over bet, and often leans in another direction because Chad horses offer no value on a day to day basis in New York.

And those suggesting Practical Joke was a bad opinion......he was one of 19 losing horses on Derby Day so there were a lot of those that day. But he was hardly embarrassed, running 5th at 30-1 and likely has some big wins ahead before his career is over.

Not sure he deserves the vitriol on the day he picked a $29 horse without taking any virtual victory laps that i've seen.

And I would consider him a friend as well, so does that minimize my personal opinion to defend him? That's up to everyone else.
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Re: The Preakness

Postby Admin » Sun May 21, 2017 7:56 am

Horsebagger wrote:
Somnambulist wrote:Who cares, he's a cancer on the sport. He dishes it so he can theoretically take it.

I feel like feeling bad for him is like feeling bad for my clients whining about money when they own 5 homes and a Bentley.


A cancer? whoa back....way overboard, imo. Andy can be abrasive at times in defending his opinion (publicly and privately), but I've yet to find anyone in the sport who says anything about him other than he's their friend. His job is to often be critical, and he is. Even when he's talking about friends (i.e. Chad Brown). He is very open about his friendship with Chad and while he often lands on a CB horse, well, Chad seems to win a lot. And Andy doesn't hesitate to point out often that Chad gets over bet, and often leans in another direction because Chad horses offer no value on a day to day basis in New York.

And those suggesting Practical Joke was a bad opinion......he was one of 19 losing horses on Derby Day so there were a lot of those that day. But he was hardly embarrassed, running 5th at 30-1 and likely has some big wins ahead before his career is over.

Not sure he deserves the vitriol on the day he picked a $29 horse without taking any virtual victory laps that i've seen.

And I would consider him a friend as well, so does that minimize my personal opinion to defend him? That's up to everyone else.


I picked PJ to hit the board, but think that picking him to win was a reach. Don't you think Chad will cut him back in distance now? I'm not surprised he finished nearer to the front of the pack than the latter (since I picked him to do so) but there's not a whole lot to brag about finishing third and fourth when it's 8 lengths back. Was it a length or two more back to fifth?

I sent no vitriol Serling's way, just his fanship becomes clear when he picked 2 diff Brown horses to win these 2 races. It reminded me of the other times I've seen a Brown bias in his picks and tweets. It's something I'd keep in mind if I were listening to him for any handicapping advice.
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