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Re: Ziconic

Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 8:53 pm
by sweettalk
luvsgeldings wrote:he always seems to get off slowly - and yes, he is always running wide on the home turn - he is little, but he is trying. I thought they should have kept him on the turf - but he ran well on the dirt today - so maybe next time.
who knows, maybe the turf was a wake up call? i'm ready for him to scratch that M off his race record and i really think he can/will.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:50 pm
by Curtis
Starine wrote:I think his problem is that he's slow.
Ding, Ding, Ding, Ding.......We have a winner!

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:54 pm
by sweettalk
we're all aware he's slow. plenty of slow horses break their maidens. sorry we're trying to guess what it would take for this slow horse to slowly break his maiden, outside of a class drop, which they won't do.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 11:48 pm
by Curtis
sweettalk wrote:we're all aware he's slow. plenty of slow horses break their maidens. sorry we're trying to guess what it would take for this slow horse to slowly break his maiden, outside of a class drop, which they won't do.
Never has so much been made out of so little. Careful what you wish for, his maiden may be his best friend.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 1:56 am
by Diver52
He needs to be trained and ridden to get out of the gate running. He's not Zenyatta, he can't give the field ten lengths. But he isn't hopeless.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 2:33 am
by sweettalk
why would we want him to stay a maiden?
(i really like you curtis, so i hope you know i don't mean this to pick a fight.)

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:37 am
by bare it all
I feel like if this horse had a different trainer we'd see much different results. Sorry not sorry.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 8:12 am
by BornToWin
Is there a replay somewhere?

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 10:35 am
by firehorse
BornToWin wrote:Is there a replay somewhere?
Calracing.com has all CA replays for free the day after the race. Some, but not always all, can also be found on Bloodhorse sometime after as well:

https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing ... -on-8-2-17

By coincidence they had Zenyatta's 2009 Clement Hirsch replay on TVG Classics last night, I had never seen her pre-race antics for that race in particular before - she was definitely in 'beast mode' (quite a comparison in size and attitude to her youngest son), for those who never saw her in person up close and don't get what all the fuss about her was, it would be a good watch if on again - it's the closest thing I've seen on video in capturing what it felt like to see/meet her in person.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:38 pm
by Curtis
sweettalk wrote:why would we want him to stay a maiden?
(i really like you curtis, so i hope you know i don't mean this to pick a fight.)
I think with horses it's good to look at the big picture and that picture should be drawn with something easily removable. I like vine charcoal, myself. Now I don't know what the Mosses are thinking but here's what I see. Once Ziconic breaks his maiden, he'll have to go into AOC races which right now will have one or two late developing 3yo with a future of some sort and a small field size. This will probably result in a tepid pace and a non-competitive 4th for our subject. If he stays a maiden awhile, he'll be more competitive and if he can break that maiden late in the year, those AOC races may not be as tough. Now again, I don't know what the plan is for Ziconic. Maybe the Mosses just want him to get a win, try a couple of AOC's and then assess. If he can't hang at that level, he'd make a fine Polo horse stallion--and I mean that sincerely. My daughter plays at Montana State University, her coach is a nationally ranked player. Worse things could happen.

As for yesterday, I thought he ran fine and he was betable, instead, I took my daughter to see Dunkirk, boy was I disappointed. I expected to see a documentary about that gray Pletcher horse and all I saw was a yacht being bombed and shot at, but I digress. As for Ziconic, I don't think Ward, Baffert or Paul Jones training him would make an appreciable difference at the point. He looked like he broke alright and then dropped back as I expected he would. I think a mile is good for him because to get position, the horses in front of him have to gun a bit out of the gate and the pace is faster and he needs a fast pace. As for his stature and stride, it is what it is. As for going wide, it's the price of his doing business. Against the class of horse he'll be pitched against, I don't ever see him crafting a stalking trip and if they force him into that he probably won't finish.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:43 pm
by Curtis
BornToWin wrote:Is there a replay somewhere?
Del Mar has an app. You can view the replays soon after the race.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 12:58 pm
by luvsgeldings
thanks firehorse, for the tip on the tvg classic zenyatta Hirsch show - I have missed it - will be on the lookout for it now for sure - she was so much fun to watch - it will bring back memories - I still miss seeing her run... and putting on her prerace show!

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:38 pm
by sweettalk
Curtis wrote:I took my daughter to see Dunkirk, boy was I disappointed. I expected to see a documentary about that gray Pletcher horse and all I saw was a yacht being bombed and shot at
:lol: :lol:

for all the things that post said (that definitely made a lot of sense), this is the part i'm walking away with.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 2:19 pm
by stark
This coming Friday, a mile on the turf could be graduation day!

1 Combat Zone D. Van Dyke 123 Lbs J. Sadler L
2 Street to Indy T. Baze 123 Lbs T. Bell, II L
3 Cascade Rock (IRE) C. Nakatani 123 Lbs N. Drysdale L
4 Gosilently R. Bejarano 123 Lbs R. Falcone, Jr. L
5 Frankincense M. Smith 123 Lbs R. Mandella L
6 Papa Jazz S. Elliott 123 Lbs R. Baltas L
7 Ziconic V. Espinoza 123 Lbs J. Shirreffs

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 5:48 pm
by Curtis
Unfortunately, once again, the circumstance lead to no pomp.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 2:37 pm
by Sparrow Castle
Jeremy Balan Verified account @BH_JBalan
Had a conversation with John Shirreffs this morning. Ziconic is turned out for some time off. He also told me he'll be getting the 2017 Zenyatta filly by Medaglia d'Oro. Been a tough run for Zenyatta, especially after she lost her Into Mischief foal this season.

Jeremy Balan Verified account @BH_JBalan
Shirreffs on Ziconic's future, specifically:
“If he comes back and still wants to be a racehorse, we’ll think about another year and hopefully send him out a winner."

https://twitter.com/BH_JBalan/status/10 ... 8073329664

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 3:46 pm
by Private Thoughts
Oh yuck, why send her to him? He hasn't had a smashing record with the first two.

If she were mine I would send her to Steve Asmussen.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 3:53 pm
by Treve
I understand loyalty, and I do like Shireffs don't get me wrong but at this point I'm wondering if a different trainer with a different approach wouldn't be better for Ziconic, nevermind the Medaglia d'Oro, I was hoping they'd try someone else. Someone who isn't going to try and train her like her mother, but rather utilise whatever natural talents she has.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2018 4:19 pm
by Squeaky
He needs to be retired and be retrained like Coz.

Re: Ziconic

Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2018 8:16 pm
by Izvestia
I really don’t think either of them are/were talented, not Shirreffs fault.